Re: At the end of my teather with LSMB

[beamends <..hidden..>]

On Sat, 2008-05-24 at 17:51 -0400, Luke wrote:
> On Sat, 24 May 2008, beamends wrote:
> 
> > On Fri, 2008-05-23 at 14:51 -0400, Luke wrote:
> > > Use an AP transaction.
> > > 
> > 
> > But how to deal with VAT (sales tax)?  If I have to deal with that
> > separately I'm in danger of missing something. 
> 
> I don't know how things work with VAT, but here, the vendor puts sales tax 
> right on the receipt, and collects it.  So it is an expense to me.
> 
> Therefore, on the AP Transaction, it is just another line item, attributed 
> to a different expense account.
> 
> I'm guessing that VAT works differently, however, or you would have 
> already done that, as indicated below.

The VAT should work, but the problem is that if I enter an AP
transaction it doesn't always appear!

> 
> > Sorry to rant, but I've wasted three days now just trying to enter one
> > fuel receipt - all I want to do is:
> > 
> > Purchases->Expenses->Vehicle Expenses->Fuel
> 
> Oh, how straight forward, and therefore impossible, that would be.

Agreed, and it *can* be done - my old system (single user, and flat-file
dbase, hence the need to upgrade) does just that, and is successor
Accountz also does (no stock control though, so rather expensive for
what it does do).

> 
> This needs to be done through AP -> AP Transaction:
> Select the vendor (or create one called "cash" or "misc. Fuel Stations" or 
> something);
> Enter the date;
> Enter the first amount, and select the fuel expense account from the 
> dropdown;
> enter the vat as another line item (may have to update first), selecting 
> the proper tax account or expense account from the drop down;
> hit update; and post.
> 
> Of course, that would would work, if VAT was charged like sales tax is 
> here.  I'm guessing that you need something more complex, like our use 
> tax, wherein you pay instead of the vendor.
> In that case, if your tax calculations are setup correctly, checking the 
> box for tax might work.
> 

As I understand it, for practical purposes, VAT & GST work the same way
bar the shouting. Again the issue is really disappearing entries.

> > Type in the name of the supplier
> 
> It has long been a complaint of mine, that a new customer/vendor can not 
> be created right on the forms for invoices/transactions.  There is a bug 
> report posted, in which someone claims to have made a button for this, and 
> posted the code.  Not sure how it works, though.
> 
> > I've got 7 days now to get my return in (including the time in the
> > post). I'm afraid I'm dumbfounded that LSMB can't do this, and the same
> > for rent, postage, office supplies, sundries, bits bought as one-off's
> > from rarely used suppliers etc.
> 
> It can be done--you just have to either enter every supplier as a vendor; 
> or make a misc vendor of some kind, entering the real name in the notes.
> As for VAT: I know plenty of people were doing it with SQL-Ledger, so I 
> assume the same techniques would work for Ledgersmb.  I just don't know 
> what they are.
> Might check the sql-ledger mailing list archives.
> 

I did say this in reply to Stroller, but I did that through my AOL
account and it seem to have gone west, so at risk of repeating myself
I'll mention that the really frustrating thing is I started doing the
return a month ago. Sadly a non-stop list of errors, both mine and the
system, has meant that I've had to check everything against the
paperwork - in reality I've done the return manually.

The show stopper was on Friday though - I finished up with 10 ledger
entries for the same fuel bill (not a problem in it's self, but very
time consuming) all with the SAME number. As is obvious I'm no
accountant, but there is no way I'd present that to our accountant - if
I can't work out what's going on on the day I do it, he has no chance!

Together with "missing" invoice, purchase order etc numbers (where I've
delayed posting due to a queue in the shop, or simply forgetting, the
accounts would be highly suspect to him, and indeed to the VAT people
who would, I suspect, reject them out-of-hand and demand a fully audited
re-count as they would have "unrecorded cash transactions" written all
over them . As this can be up to 7 years later, such a scenario does not
even bear thinking about....

Also in Stroller's reply he state that he actually uses a Book Keeper to
enter data in another system to present to his accountant. That's pretty
damming - if I'd known that.......... good old 20/20 hindsight.

> > And how the hell I'm going
> > to work out opening and closing stock balances I have no idea
> 
> A vendor invoice is the normal way to set onhand values.  It would mess up 
> COGS to enter one with a zero cost, so you might find your true stocking 
> invoices, and enter them correctly.
> 

Indeed - with stock being far and away our biggest asset, it has to be
right. Changing the value either way takes the company from to profit to
loss at a stroke. That is why being able to produce a stock valuation on
demand is so vital - and it has to be correct (ok, bar the off write-of
for loss, theft, damage etc).

> > - I can't
> > even see how to flag out-of-stock items from suppliers as being
> > cancelled orders. I'm faced with closing for a week to to a full stock
> > check now.
> 
> Not sure I understand that.

Where we order a non-stock part for a customer (but have it in the dbase
for pricing, web site etc) it may not be available currently from the
supplier. Often this means the customer will cancel their order. When I
have booked such a part in through "Shipping->Receive Goods" it just
sits there forever it seems, on it's original order which is never fully
closed. It doesn't actually matter as such, but it does mean I have to
look at the order every so often to remind myself why it is there, and
whether or not the order has been cancelled.

> 
> > LSMB is probably great for accountants for all I know, but the small
> > businessman who has no time, or frankly interest, to become an
> > accountant there is an awful lot of work to be done to make it useful.
> 
> Indeed.  That is why I keep pushing for a true API, so that alternative 
> front ends, such as something with a postbooks/tinyerp feel, could be 
> made.

Over the past 18 months I looked as every single system, Windows and
Linux, I could find, even commercial ones up to Â5,000 or Â1,000 annual
"rental". My initial criteria were:

1. Can I make head or tail of it at all, form a users perspective
(bearing in mind that "ordinary" staff are going to have to use it, who
couldn't give a dam if things go in the wrong accounts etc).
(POS is not really an option - none of our products have bar codes, and
finding the right part requires full access top the Stock records)

That got rid of the majority

2. Are there stock locations? Amazingly, very few systems have this -
that leaves me totally baffled. I assume most developers assume as shop
("Store") is some kind of supermarket rather than a counter with stores
behind - ruling out practically the whole engineering, motor trade and
such from using the system. Even where they can be added, unless they
become part of the master record the sales process starts to get to
complex - staff will simply not use it/obstruct it (and I don't blame
them).

That left about 10 possibilities (really! Have look....)

3. Can I import (prices lists, new lines, obsolete parts etc) easily,
and export the info I need very easily for web site updates (those
systems with either in-built or interfaces to e-commerce force a given
site style, which are useless for the line I'm in)?   

That ruled out pretty much everything except LSMB, SQL-Ledger and
Quasar, the only survivors from from 1 and 2.
 
LSMB looked the part, and on bench testing all seemed well. As ever with
software though, using it for real under pressure soon raised issues,
which puts me under more pressure, and so the circle goes.

I understand that the developers have historical issues with the dbase
to address, but I feel that at least one should be concentrating on
UI/Usability issues.

LSMB may be fine for an accountant, or a small business that can afford
to have one on hand all the time, but for Joe Bloggs who has decided to
start selling Widgets it is likely to increase overhead rather than
reduce it, which makes it less than effective as a tool. The same goes
for all accounts systems by the way, with the notable exception of
Accountz. They are all geared up to mimic ledger books (necessary behind
the scenes), rather than place an interface on top of the ledgers that
anyone can understand. There's another 5 businesses that would
computerise on this site if that were done. The industry is missing a
trick here, though I have to say that showing our old system to a
prospective accountant a while back raised another issue - he simply
could not get his head round the fact that the front end didn't
immediately start showing ledgers but referred to "Purchases" and
"Sales" that us mere mortals understand.

Incidently, Qausar (Linux Canada) have a new version just out - much
improved, though no longer open source. 


> 
> Luke
> 

Cheers
Richard

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